I'm planning on putting together a website on the new Police State frame of mind the US is apparently headed into, and wanted to get a random sampling of thoughts on the subject; would you please submit some opinions?
| FREEDOM related links
www.vrpro.net/freenet
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The main reason for this? The Federal Gov. is apparently going to start funding the placement of Video Surveillance cams in major cities of the US, similar to the system in place in England. These cameras are automatically scanned using "faceprints"/FaceIt technology, enabling the fed to track your every move. | You can also e-mail your opinion to: thegrove1@hotmail.com
See the results, and more |
How about a website that lets people give the location of surveillance cameras, and gives ideas on how to disable them without getting a vanalism charge? like paint balloons, strategically positioned laser pointers, Ink filled squirt guns, solar powered spark-gap transmitters, or even just tape and cardboard?
You shouldn't try to interfere with people who are just trying to help.
I think its hard to tell on this one. In most situations the benefits outweigh the concerns, however, I really am not sure in this country that its a great idea. Well, actually I think its a wonderful idea, but in practicality, it will be a problem. The idea is to keep crime down by being able to respond to various problems, be it violent crimes, or whatnot.
However, the idea that it can be used to "spy" on people is a bit early to tell. Tho I can envision a future where you personally can be monitored around, and not just by "faceprinting" on a camera. Im talking about tracing DNA and various other tells. Think of it as an electronic bloodhound, but with a much more sensitive nose.
The future has a big problem with quickly becoming the present, and progress isnt always positive, but its inevitable. The real challenge is what is done with it.
If the half of the population that didn't vote or doesn't vote, spent half their energy working with the system instead of against it, this country wouldn't be run by big corporations. See, politicians are addicted to power. If more people were in contact with their state reps and let their feelings be known on an intelligent level, we wouldn't be in the shitty state of affairs in this country.
make what you will of the above, politics is a popularity game, where only the voting ppl are counted. Think of it this way, did Gore lose by 500 or so votes, or did he lose by close to 52million? that's about how many "registered" voters didn't vote this election. Yes, they both sucked. But wouldn't it be much better to listen to corporate sponsored news stations like CNN who suck up to the politics state "yes, bush the election with 24million votes out of 53 million voters", or does this sound better, "bush won with 24 million votes out of 123 million voters"
what message do you think that gives? no, it wont make a difference in the immediate future, we are still stuck with 4 years of a retard, but, next election WILL be different. It has to be cos the game's changed.
Anyway, my pizza's here and if the votes don't get higher next election, I'm moving to Australia....least they are moving in the right direction....
toodles
'The benefits outweigh the concerns'.
I wholly disagree with that frame of mind. The concerns are your /freedom/. Your /rights/. They are steadily being eroded by the government. Does catching a few crooks really outweigh your right to privacy? I'd rather have a thousand criminals on the street than having the government watching over my shoulder. Would you trust the government with that kind of power?
'You shouldn't try to interfere with people who are just trying to help.'
Sure - roll over and pretend it's not happening. The ostrich syndrome is best. Let's all go back to watching Seinfeld (or a derivative thereof) and ignore the camera sitting on top of your TV.
Nowhere to hide in Britain.... http://www.msnbc.com/news/577446.asp?0nm=C13O
You're not exaggerating and you're not crazy. That's really what this is about. A reasonable, sane person has to question his own perceptions. Maybe I'm making a mistake..maybe I'm deceiving myself. You don't want to believe it. Unfortunately, I've been through that, and as a Canadian-USian I can report that after my recent move to the U.S. it's all frighteningly true.
It always the same, you know, the rationale: Security, Morality, Protecting Society from the Evil, destructive enemy within. And of course, any successful tyranny needs an external enemy to keep the hotheads busy elsewhere. China, Colombia, Iraq..does it matter?
I'll make a prediction: the big assualt on privacy/freedom of expression will begin as a major national campaign against pornography. Your attorney general, John Ashcroft, has a special relationship with pornography and will use the resources of the Justice department to create an efficient, intrusive and comprehensive monitoring operation. Considering that demos are now called riots, street theatre is called terrorism, it's easy to see how people who hold non-right wing opinions will be classfied as potential threats.
Frankly, though, the big question in my mind is how the Republicans and their ilk can survive another election. They're sure to lose, after the events of the last 7 months.
They don't like not winning, do they?
That ought to scare you.
Keep up the good work. Software like freenet may be the only hope in the coming years.
We've already been through a large, discontinuous jump in technology before: to wit, the invention and wide-spread use of radio, telephones, and punch card sorters.
In countries that were unfortunate enough to be ruled by tolitarian rulers at the time that these technologies emerged; Italy (Mussolini), Germany (Hitler), or the Soviet Union (Stalin); evil regimes led by evil men used the new technologies in the worst ways imaginable for propaganda, police state control over long distances, and mass-murder. In other countries that were fortunate enough to have sound governments headed by basically decent leaders, the same technologies were used for good or benigh purposes.
Though the new technologies are very impressive, I don't believe that they are so powerful that their use will be determined solely by what they make possible. Rather, their use will be determined in accordance with the basic goodness (or evilness) of the societies of different nations through the governments, businesses and other organizations that are expressions of the societies' values.
How will they deal with it if there's a mismatch? Will they detain innocent people for days until they realize there's been a mismatch, or will they have some sort of instant fingerprint system that will let them find the mistake within minutes? If they're going to do this, they need to take extra steps to make sure that people aren't held for days because they happen to look almost exactly like a felon.
Well folks, it's time to stay away from Tampa, FL; they just installed the cameras. http://www.msnbc.com/news/595361.asp?0dm=A19NT
I cannot approve of this technology, simply because gathered information can be misused.
Consider - even if only one civil servant in a hundred is willing to risk their job in return for selling everywhere you went, it is fairly likely that at least once in your life, bad folks will get your likeness, doing things you do not want known.
The benefits do not outweigh the cost in simple privacy and basic freedom.
What do you mean by, "Police State frame of mind the US is apparently headed into"?
We're there, 100%, already, it's just kept well hidden for the moment. Gradually, bit by bit, over the next 20-50 years, you'll see the last of our civil rights go by the wayside, and eventually, we'll be the religiouslly supported dictatorship we've always been two steps away from.
Benjamin Franklin said, "Those who trade freedom for safety will end up with neither." (Paraphrased)
As a Scot who has recently emigrated to Australia I have actual experience of these cameras. They have been in place in the London Underground (Tube) for sometime as well as in major city centres and violence black spots (outside nightclubs etc.)
Since the introduction of these cameras, the rate of violent crime in the cities involved has dropped massively (in some cases up to 50%). The principal crimes affected are those of vandalism, assault and rape. Less affected crimes are "organised" or "pre-meditated" crimes although the incidence of these crimes in areas under surveillance has likewise been reduced. There is some debate as to whether overall crime has been reduced or merely displaced to areas not under surveillance however the general feeling is that there has been a general reduction in crime levels which can be directly attriobuted to video surveillance.
On the whole therefore, these cameras and related computer systems may be seen as a good thing.
HOWEVER there is a fundamental difference between the US and the UK cultures.
The UK does not allow private ownership of handguns. Nor is every police officer armed.
In England and Wales 1998/9 there were 2687 reported crimes involving firearms. In the same period in the US, there were 30,708 DEATHS from firearms (about 60% suicide, 40% homicide)
The following stats are gun deaths per 100,000 population in 1998: USA – 14.24 Switzerland – 5.31 Scotland – 0.54 England & Wales – 0.41
I would say these present a clear and compelling case that removing firearms from circulation reduces firearm related deaths.
However most of the Americans I have met (and as an international traveller for an IT company I've met a LOT of them), whilst otherwise intelligent, charming people have a huge blind spot when it comes down to gun ownership.
It seems to me that US culture puts an individual's "rights" above the common good of the community and consequently there will always be a backlash against measures which - whilst they may be immediately beneficial to the whole community - adversely impact an individual or groups perceived "rights".
This cultural position is assuredly the product of the evolution of the US, a backlash against the repressive governments of the past (McCarthyism etc.), collective guilt regarding slavery, the cold war, and a rise to pre-eminence in the world which was so rapid as to outstrip the evolution of a society which could cope with such power.
It is interesting that for all the talk of "rights" in the US there is correspondingly little talk of "responsibilities".
Please understand that I am not attempting to insult the US or its people. Only trying to understand how a culture so alien to my own functions and could come to be, as I have said, all of the Americans I have met have been charming and intelligent people.
In summary, I believe that given the current rate of violent crime in the US, measures need to be introduced to combat it. Surveillance cameras have proven effective in the UK where we have been fighting domestic terrorism for many years. Most have accepted it as a necessary evil to reduce the threat of terror as well as of random street crime.
I certainly don't subscribe to the view that "If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear" - the British government and police force have been as guilty as others when it comes to the abuse of power. "Quis custodiet ipso custodes?" will always be an important question but I believe that the way forward is through transaparent and accountable government, not a dogmatic adherence to the rights of the individual regardless of the impact on society as a whole.
For a thoughtful and well written discussion, please see:
http://www.i-resign.com/uk/workinglife/viewarticle_107.asp
Sweet. I don't have any problem with the Fed tracking my every move. They would be wasting their time..... I don't do or sell drugs, cavort with prostitutes, mug people, or any other illegal thing with the exception of the occasional speeding violation. If I were a criminal or into shady dealings I would be scared spitless at the idea of a lot of surveillance.
Now... If they make stuff like "being a Republican" or "Being of German descent" or "attending Sunday School" into an illegal activity then I would have a lot to worry about.
The surveillance cams will just make it easier for the police to do their jobs.... and to know if Osama comes over here for holiday.
Where is a good discreet homepage setup (here?) please ?
I need it with cgi ASP FTP ?
Brian http://www.apoem.com peedoff@operamail.com
do nothing unlawful, no worries.
Just a quick comment: use the "Virtual Keyboard", windows accessability tool, to get around the Magic Lantern trojan. Should work.
In the so called view of public safety, the cure is definitely worse than disease. Functioning technobots are so wrapped up in their lives they can't see through the illusions perpetrated by the gov't. !984 by Orwell is just the tip of the iceberg. Wait, there's more: sector police, food shortages, electronic implants, etc; all in the name of safety and convienience. JC
If you arent doing anything wrong then you shouldnt have a problem. Just because the police or the local governments want to put cameras to catch criminals in actions doesnt mean our rights are being erroded. What "privacy" do you think you should have walking in a "public area"?
You people are either suffering from paranoia or afraid of getting caught doing something wrong.
For the guy who said "I'd rather have a thousand criminals on the street than having the government watching over my shoulder", you are a moron. Thats about the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. You should reconsider ever giving your opinion.
Memorize the Bill of Rights! Fight fang-&-talon whenever anyone attempts to deprive you of even the smallest one of your unalienable rights! Fight any and all! Fight alone and fight in groups (there is power in numbers)! Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatus nunc (We gladly feast on those who would subdue us)! With Lust, Draco Sangreal
Amendment I Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Amendment II A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
Amendment III No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
Amendment IV The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Amendment V No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
Amendment VI In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.
Amendment VII In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise reexamined in any Court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.
Amendment VIII Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.
Amendment IX The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
Amendment X The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
The rise of surveilance technologies brings up the one eternal question in governance: Who watches the watchmen?
In some areas within the US, civil liberties are well protected by the local and state courts (especially Alaska); in others, State and Local courts have consistently narrowed civil rights time and again. (California is the key example for the latter.)
But with all due rspect, how many of the Federal Appellate and Supreme Justices are really in touch with the power modern surrveilance techniques can provide?
Likewise, the system continues to lengthen and broaden copyright protections. This is BAD. This is the first step tom eliminating freedom of speach. If everything you publish becomes copyright the moment you publish it, then anyone else sying the same thing has just committed a breach of copyright. A can of worms awaiting opening.
Arguably, California is already a police state, and NYC could be seen as such; Alaska is not, and is likely to revolt if the federal governement goes too far toward the police state. How many states, however, will hit the police state status before the union is swept by federal paradigmn shifts towards police state mentality.
Hello there from Austin, Texas. We've got cameras all over the place.
The begining of the end. How long will the card house be built before the inevitable collapse? We are teetering on madness and we are the conditioned card hose builder. Figure out the truth and do not fear, but accept.
the site is great i really enjoyed seeing everything well done whoever made it.
jenni rowe
the site is great i really enjoyed seeing everything well done whoever made it.
jenni rowe
"Naturally the common people don't want war: Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
--Hermann Goering at the Nuremberg Trials
Sound familiar? It should it's happening right now.
absolutley not they shouldnt get into our lives unless they know for a fact we are guilty of an illegal action!
Our government is only doing what the people who control it wants it to do. With the massive inequality we now have these are the measures required to protect this wealth and power from the rest of us. After all we're just a bunch of lazy worthless mooches who just want to collect welfare and do nothing and their money needs to be protected from us. We have too much and too many right it's time to put us in our place... that being back under control. Please examine this government document, the circumstances outlined here are dramatically worse with the dawn of the 21st century.This is how "Class warfare" is conducted. Industrial Commission Report to Congress
- The commission's findings on anti-union activities:
"Almost with out exception the employees of large corporations are unorganized, as result of the active and aggressive ‘non-union' policy of the corporation managements", the commission continued. Our Rockefellers, Morgans, Fricks, Vanderbilts and Astors can do no wrong because all effective action and direct responsibility is shifted from them to executive officials..."
On influence of the media:
In addition, the commission found, the Morgans, Rockefellers, and their allies were controlling the thoughts of Americans as well as their lives. Through monopoly ownership of influence, the press expressed monopoly's policies. Moreover, Wall Street was increasingly controlling public education, as well as colleges, universities, professors, and preachers through gifts, endowments, and foundations. The report continued:
"The domination by the men in whose hands the final control of a large part of American industry rests is not limited to their employees, but is being rapidly extended to control the education and ‘social service' of the Nation. This control is being rapidly extended largely through the creation of enormous privately managed funds for indefinite purposes, hereinafter designated as "foundations" by the endowment of colleges and universities, by contributions to private charities as well as through controlling and influencing the public press...
On citizen inequality and financial concentration:
"Incapable of being spent in any legitimate manner, these fortunes are burdens, which can only be squandered, hoarded, put into so-called ‘benefactions' which for the most part constitute a menace to the state, or put back into the industrial machine to pile up ever-increasing mountains of gold. We have according to income tax returns, forty-four families with an income of $1,000,000 annually or more, whose members perform little or no useful service, but whose aggregate incomes, totaling fifty millions a year, are equivalent to the earnings of 100,000 wage earners at the average rate of $500."
For the uninitiated this is a group of powerful "Elites" using the control methods of totalitarian goverments. This is who our government was designed to serve... first before " We the People". The industrial Commission was a "conservative" committee appointed by congress, this report was submitted to congress in 1915. These excerpts from the Commission report and additional commentary were obtained from"Labor's Untold Story" by Boyer and Morais. This book is currently back in print.This is not going on only in the US this is an ongoing part of "Globalization". Take a look at this government document, this is how class warfare is conducted. The circumstances outlined here are dramatically worse with the dawn of the Twenty First Century.
Freedom and justice will continue to be subverted as long as we have a small group of people ruling. In this case the political and corporate elites have a stranglehold on the election process by controlling money (which is now considered free-speech instead of currency, thus meaning the rich have more free speech then the rest of us) and offering the common folk two choices -- Democrat or Republican -- Both made up of wan party lackies.
A few exception do occur in people like Rus Feingold and John McCain: They are the exceptions, feared by the establishment for their efforts to return democracy to the people. What can be done short of picking up a rifle and starting an insurrection?
We all have to get off our backsides and start new parties. The Republican party, originally, was made up of people disgusted with the appeasement of slave owners in allowing more slave states into the union. These little parties can in time unite into a larger party and knock the Republicans and Democrats to the curb, where the bums belong. So get out there, choose a side and fight for your political rights, damn it -- before you see your children and grandchildren grow up under the boots of the growing American police state.
no
let's hope they don't start requiring DNA sampling from everyone in the States.
A link to Jerry Pournelle's website might be in order for you; he's discussed the U.S.'s long descent from Republic to Empire and has lots of nice info about it.
its alot of bullshit! why do you think you need to track everybody, its real simple, you dont! fuck the govt. for another invasion of privacy
every version of win, since win2k sp2, or any computer that has installed mediaplayer >7.1 has an agreement to let MS or whoever they want look in, change, alter or modify your computer.
WinMe was full of holes, but that may have just been bad design. Soooo for me it's win98se, win2ksp2 and nothing more, ever, from MS. Zplayer is a open source media player that does everything that ms-mediaplayer does, better, except ASF and WMV, and mediplayer 4-7.0 play those just fine.
They can read your terminal's screen almost as good as you can, from up to about 150+/- yards using tempest; however, due to the nature of the beast, you can change your screen resolution in about 5 seconds, but it takes them about 15-20 minutes to find the new settings.
They can bug your keyboard...either with a trojan, a hardware device, or tempest...but the only thing the above steps wouldn't protect you from is the hardware / trojan; use "virtual keyboard" to put in your PGP passphrases and any really seditious text.
Mandrake linux is nice. and there is a new version of slackware; with WineX, you can even play the LATEST games, like SimCity 4 and MOO3.
Of course, reading everything your computer sends out to the internet, or comes in either is simplicity its self, unless it's encrypted (PGP) or in a encrypted communications stream (Freenet, VPN, PPTP, PGPnet, HTTPS).
I know entirely toooooo much about this subject.
fuck the world
I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one who sees this extremely disturbing pattern. I was beginning to think that I was the only person who had even noticed the ever-expanding violations of the constitution that the U.S. Government is guilty of.
I am so sick of people saying things like "you have nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide." That's so foolish. Once these technologies have been "let out of the bag," once their use has been declared "fair game" and as been (however reluctantly) accepted by the population, the government will never, ever, relinquish them. And what the right-wing would-be theocrats don't understand is that *they* may, eventually, be the ones under scrutiny -- who's to say that evangelical Christianity won't, at some point in the future, be regarded as a threat, as source of divisive propaganda, a sponsor of terrorism, and a threat to the security of the state. Well, if the ancient Romans had had the benefit of modern surveillance technology, we would all be worshipping Jupiter-Best-and-Greatest, Mithras, and Sol Invictus, and Christianity would be a long-extinct obscure sect of Judaism. Once the playing piece is on the board, it is almost sure to *stay* on the board, and *whoever* happens to be playing will be free to use it. People who are "on top" always believe they will be "on top" forever. Fools. So, go ahead, Ashcroft, install your video cameras -- but when your great-grandchildren's covert prayer session is rudely interrupted by Odin-worshipping paramilitary brownshirts kicking down the door, don't come crying to me. Silly, yes... but history tends to make fools of people who make timid predictions.
Boston, April 20
National Guard units seeking to confiscate a cache of recently banned assault weapons were ambushed on April 19th by elements of a para-military extremist faction. Military and law enforcement sources estimate that 72 were killed and more than 200 injured before government forces were compelled to withdraw. Speaking after the clash, Massachusetts governor Thomas Gage declared that the extremist faction, which was made up of citizens, has links to the radical right-wing tax protest movement. Gage blamed the extremists for recent incidents of vandalism directed against internal revenue offices.
The governor, who described the group's organizers as criminals, issued an executive order authorizing the summary arrest of any individual who has interfered with the government's efforts to secure law and order. The military raid on the extremist arsenal followed widespread refusal by the local citizenry to turn over recently outlawed assault weapons. Gage issued a ban on military-style assault weapons and ammunition earlier in the week. This decision followed a meeting in early April between government and military leaders at which the governor authorized the forcible confiscation of illegal arms.
One government official, speaking on condition of anonymity, pointed out that none of these people would have been killed had the extremists obeyed the law and turned over their weapons voluntarily. Government troops initially succeeded in confiscating a large supply of outlawed weapons and ammunition. However, troops attempting to seize arms and ammunition in Lexington met with resistance from heavily-armed extremists who had been tipped off regarding the government's plans.
During a tense standoff in Lexington's town park, National Guard Colonel Francis Smith, commander of the government operation, ordered the armed group to surrender and return to their homes. The impasse was broken by a single shot, which was reportedly fired by one of the right-wing extremists. Eight civilians were killed in the ensuing exchange. Ironically, the local citizenry blamed government forces rather than the extremists for the civilian deaths. Before order could be restored, armed citizens from surrounding areas had descended upon the guard units. Colonel smith, finding his forces overmatched by the armed mob, ordered a retreat.
Governor Gage has called upon citizens to support the state/national joint task force in its effort to restore law and order. The governor has also demanded the surrender of those responsible for planning and leading the attack against the government troops. Samuel Adams, Paul Revere, and John Hancock, who have been identified as ringleaders of the extremist faction, remain at large.
My opinion is one like all but it hold,s weight trapping peoples comment,s on your page espescially when it is embarrassing and is a mistake is called hostage web hosting !Now case in point vamires guild if people do not want their messages posted for all to see a mistake should it not be the responsibil;ity of the page holder to delete it or is the commentary his sick little goth way of hostage taking someones regrettable comment for a 30 year old man really vampires cmon grow up and get a job bum
As one who lived through the security measures of WWII, this so called police state you folks talk about these days is a Sunday School Class. You folks don't know the definition of "POLICE STATE".
well thats not a good sign, the federal government says its for the best, but it can also be abused in a very bad way which can disrupt the lives and our faith in the government.
what do you mean headed into? look around
I THINK ITS AN INVASION OF ARE WRITES.
I am torn by the current state of our states. I see a need to protect the public from crime, and see a very effective way to monitor for public safety. But I feel the price may be individual liberty. The individual is the ulitimate minority today. I have learned that if you are not a member of a "protected class" any wrongs done to you do not matter to the authorities charged with protecting your rights. So I think that any intrusions or erosion of liberty should not take place until individual liberty is restored to america's citizens. That may include tolerating a certain level of seditious activity, such as talking about delicate things as revolution, but that acting on those talks in a violent manner would not be tolerated and would cause those acting in that way to be jailed. We have ways of changing things in this country that are peaceful, and legal. And while the prospect of video surveliance, say at bus malls or high crime areas seem ok, I would be very vigilant that our police departments do not become overzealous, and put cameras on every street corner as is happening in Britain. We are still somewhat free today. I want to be free to do what I please, as long as my activity does not encroach on another's freedom.
you fucking tard....i dont want this gay site... i want to find essays not this crap opinions
THEY ARN'T TRYING TO STUPID LAMB! THE GOVERNMENT WANTS TO GET IN OUR HEADS! THEY KNOW EVERYONE WHOSE BEEN ON THIS SITE, THEY TRACK EVERYTHING ON THIS SUBJECT! YOU FAGS JUST GAVE THEM MORE INFORMATION AND AIDED THEM IN THE DUMBING OF THE MASSES! FIGHT THE FUCKING POWER BITCHES! FIGHT THE GOVERNMENT!
(note from the admin: This is a private site, logs have never been requested by law enforcement, if they HAD been, I couldn't say that legally)
Sorry folks, as long as the cameras are in public spaces, there is no invasion of privacy. I believe, and the supreme court agrees that if you are out in public you have to accept that you are in plain sight and therefore subject to observation, casual or otherwise. If this wassn't true you could accuse anyone who looked at you a "peeping tom." In short, you got no legal or moral complaint
This is bad for our civil liberties. The US is looking more like a Communist country, then the USSR is. While we send soldiers to fight for peoples freedoms we are giving ours away.
The police State didn't start with camera's and biometrics these things are the last steps in an ever progressing move toward total police state domination. We started this total decent into total tyranny when we allowed the government total or near total control of our children. We now have uncontrolled government agencies who can take away any of our children on nothing more than an unconfirmed whim that a child might be abused. These agencies have cried wolf so long that most people don't believe them even when they are trying to rescue a truely abused child. We are also far from a corrupt system of law, so political dessenters or those that try to expose corruption end up in jail. Our system of money has been corrupted since the federal reserve came into being. Accually I was hard pressed after researching the subject of money to find a truely good and fair system of commerce. Trade and ecconomics have been manipulated and fought over as far back as I was able to research at least as far back as bible times.
Gov't tracks citizens,shouldn't be a problem for citizens to track gov't. Free country?
Our government is not doing anything for the interest of the citizens, but only to make there jobs easy. I honestly belive that those who 'we' the citizens have voted in to offices to represent our country will end up turning against those of whom they should be representing. Our government needs to look at what the citizens will be thinking about someone knowing everything about them. Or else the people will start turning against them!
>> "Sorry folks, as long as the cameras are in public spaces, there is no invasion of privacy. I believe, and the supreme court agrees that if you are out in public you have to accept that you are in plain sight and therefore subject to observation, casual or otherwise. If this wassn't true you could accuse anyone who looked at you a 'peeping tom.' In short, you got no legal or moral complaint"
Observation is one thing. Tracking is quite another. Unless there is specific credible suspicion of a crime, nobody should ever be tracked. But they will be.
For those who say "commit no crime and you have nothing to worry about": We already have cases of police officers abusing their powers to retaliate against people who have honestly accussed them of things. We have cases of police officers abusing their powers to attack (for instance) a woman who is divorcing him & hiding from him. These cameras will extend such abilities.
You think our authorities would never do such things? Look at the things they did to real protesters during the 60's civil rights movement.
"I'd rather have a thousand criminals on the street than having the government watching over my shoulder. Would you trust the government with that kind of power? "
How would you like one, or several, of those 1000 criminals raping your wife or daughter (husband, son)??? Or better yet, how about if they rape you while your family watches.
Live a happy life, obey the law, and don't worry about the cameras. Their not looking at you, their look out for you.
police presence promotes crime. the very thought that if a cop isn't there we will commit a crime has been pounded into our brains, and so if a cop is there, were are automatically watching ourselves to see what we are doing that is illegal. we should be ale to govern ourselves. fuck the cops.
they can viedo me all they want all they will see is me puttering around the yard doing things i l;ike best. working on cars and trucks ect ect. i have NOTHING to HIDE.
This a useful site! Keep up the great work!
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Someone earlier wrote:
It seems to me that US culture puts an individual's "rights" above the common good of the community and consequently there will always be a backlash against measures TRUE VERY TRUE
It is interesting that for all the talk of "rights" in the US there is correspondingly little talk of "responsibilities". ALSO VERY TRUE
***Why are we (Americans) so afraid of technology? Most countries have much more restricted "personal rights/freedoms" and they are still happy. Ask the Sweds/Norwegians/British/Canadaians/Australians and a large portion of Europeans about "personal restrictions", and they have learned to live with them, and value other things that replaced by them. For example, lower crime rates, better health care and on and on. We need to give a little to get a lot.
you are gay
you stupid thing you dont send this no more
you wont spy on me no more now that got your ass
spy on me and i will kill you
bitch
thoes who trade liberty for peace and security get neither --ben franklin . learn this truth or freedom will perish!
those who trade liberty for peace and security get neither --ben franklin . learn this truth or freedom will perish!
America is a Police State. Cops lie and steal every day . Because cops lie, you can be
arrested at any time for any reason. Americas police state is only to protect the wealthy
power elite. Why do they become cops? It has been stated in numerous papers that it is a
control issue with the cops in general. That they can not control their own lives, so they
want to control yours. It is a power trip for them, plain and simple! And you hear from the
cops that they wish to serve the public! Please! These people have no form of formal real
intelligence. If they did, why would they want to be radio dispatched to complete strangers
and for 28 to 32 K a year. Cops are the D students you went to high school with, most where
bullies or where bullied. Then you have the problem that the cops lie each and every day to
make it seem their job is worse than it really is! Ever been charged with any thing? Cops
know most citizens fear and hate them. They love the fear they cause. It is also a fact
that 80% of all Police Officers have homosexual tendencies they compensate for. You almost
most feel sorry for them. As long as we have weak minded people with feelings of
inadequacy, we will have plenty of cops.
America is a Police State. Cops lie and steal every day . Because cops lie, you can be
arrested at any time for any reason. Americas police state is only to protect the wealthy
power elite. Why do they become cops? It has been stated in numerous papers that it is a
control issue with the cops in general. That they can not control their own lives, so they
want to control yours. It is a power trip for them, plain and simple! And you hear from the
cops that they wish to serve the public! Please! These people have no form of formal real
intelligence. If they did, why would they want to be radio dispatched to complete strangers
and for 28 to 32 K a year. Cops are the D students you went to high school with, most where
bullies or where bullied. Then you have the problem that the cops lie each and every day to
make it seem their job is worse than it really is! Ever been charged with any thing? Cops
know most citizens fear and hate them. They love the fear they cause. It is also a fact
that 80% of all Police Officers have homosexual tendencies they compensate for. You almost
most feel sorry for them. As long as we have weak minded people with feelings of
inadequacy, we will have plenty of cops.
As long as citizens still have the right to keep and bear arms, the US can't go too far downhill...
That aside, I think we were overdue for a security overhaul, but we're doing it all wrong. Instead of more restrictions, etc, we need to give more power to the people. We shouldn't worry about the the Muslim who prays to Allah 20 times a day. He's just doing his religeon (that is still legal, RIGHT?)... We need to be more worried about that guy who's buying 20 tons of anhydrous ammonia, or that guy at the grocery store who needs 40 gallon jugs of bleach for some "spring cleaning".
We shouldn't be creating more laws, we should be getting rid of useless laws (if you ban guns at sporting events, who has them? Only the criminals. Etc...), and reviewing our current laws.
We also need to respect privacy a bit more. The patriot act isn't neccessary. What we need are better paid, better trained police officers and more programs to educate the public in how they can help. Which is better? X-thousand well trained eyes watching you, or 200 million eyes watching out for the Terrorists?
That's just my two cents, Cowled_Wolfe (midnightsiesta@hotmail.com)
The police state frame of mind, as you call it, has existed for awhile, but it was more passive, while now it seems more active.
In general, our society is becoming much more demanding on issues of control and conformity.
My two cents, Gerb.
-Zmaster
My grand slam was supposed to be with sausage.
Design you site cool.
Cool jod you choose, dude.
I love your idea!!!!!!!
"These questions can be raised against any system which allows its users to stay anonymous while distributing contents. A more general question then is, are you against any communication mechanism which allows all parties to stay anonymous? Do you believe that any communication channel must have provision to be wiretapped? If your answer is "no", then how Tor (or FreeNet etc) should be any different. If you answer "yes", you should understand that it is basically the same as the infamous "Fair citizens need not be afraid, after all, only criminals have something to hide". Make your choice." ---#807394@/.
There is no need for you to "putting together a website", there is already a non/anti Right website, sponsored by "The Umbrella Movement to Counteract the Right"-therightiswrong.us Contact me,join with us, having been at it for over two years. Norman 'Nobody' Sommer 20355 N.E. 34th Ct. #821 Aventura, FL 33180 305-935 4434 nsommer@bellsouth.net
I would agree with you, if I agreed with more of your positions; The nanny state thing, however, is a democratic point of view that has been adopted by the conservative right. Come up with a group that condemns ANY infringement on personal liberty, and you might have something.
the UK is most surveilled country on the planet per inhabitant. It boils down to complete control, and with power and corrution following. whatever, if you sit back and take shit theres no ending to it. protest is the only answer and demand honesty from those we give our faith to. With obvious criminal behaviour like GWB is exhibiting, his fate should be exemplary
We need a web site that we can go to that tells us everything we need to know. i would like to know about police corrution involving drugs. What were there products, plans where did they get the drugs? More information needs to be on the internent concering this. Please make a difference in lots students life. thanks. MaShay
I NEED HELP THE LA. COUNTY SHERIFFS DEPARTMENT IS TRYING PUT ME AWAY MY NEIGHBOR VIDEO TAPED A LA COUNTY SHERIFFS DETECTIVE ROBBING MY HOME. BECAUSE OF THIS VIDEO TAPE MY LIFE IS IN DANGER. THIS DETECTIVE ALSO ARRESTED ME TWICE. THE FIRST TIME ON THREE FELONY COUNTS. THE SECOND TIME WAS FOR FALSE BURGLARY REPORT AND THE CHANGED TO 115 PENAL CODE. BOTH WERE ARREST WERE FELONY CHARGES. I HAVE NOT SHOWN THE TAPE TO ANYONE YET. THE CHARGES FIRST ARREST CHARGES WERE THROWN OUT. THE SECOND ARREST CHARGES WERE DROP TO CONTEMP OF COURT 166. MISTERMEANER. I HAVE NEVER BEEN IN TROUBLE WITH LAW I DONT EVEN HAVE TRAFFIC TICKET. BUT NOW I HAVE MY PHONES TAPED IM BEING FOLLOWED PULLED OVER HARRASSED DEATH THREATS AND CANT FIND ANY HELP. PLEASE HELP I HAVE FIVE CHILDREN .MY EX WIFE IS DATEING THIS DETECTIVE. THATS ON THE TAPE AS WELL. I HAVE TRANSCRIPES TAPES VIDEO LOTE OF EVIDEANCE.
I NEED HELP THE LA. COUNTY SHERIFFS DEPARTMENT IS TRYING PUT ME AWAY MY NEIGHBOR VIDEO TAPED A LA COUNTY SHERIFFS DETECTIVE ROBBING MY HOME. BECAUSE OF THIS VIDEO TAPE MY LIFE IS IN DANGER. THIS DETECTIVE ALSO ARRESTED ME TWICE. THE FIRST TIME ON THREE FELONY COUNTS. THE SECOND TIME WAS FOR FALSE BURGLARY REPORT AND THE CHANGED TO 115 PENAL CODE. BOTH WERE ARREST WERE FELONY CHARGES. I HAVE NOT SHOWN THE TAPE TO ANYONE YET. THE CHARGES FIRST ARREST CHARGES WERE THROWN OUT. THE SECOND ARREST CHARGES WERE DROP TO CONTEMP OF COURT 166. MISTERMEANER. I HAVE NEVER BEEN IN TROUBLE WITH LAW I DONT EVEN HAVE TRAFFIC TICKET. BUT NOW I HAVE MY PHONES TAPED IM BEING FOLLOWED PULLED OVER HARRASSED DEATH THREATS AND CANT FIND ANY HELP. PLEASE HELP I HAVE FIVE CHILDREN .MY EX WIFE IS DATEING THIS DETECTIVE. THATS ON THE TAPE AS WELL. I HAVE TRANSCRIPES TAPES VIDEO LOTE OF EVIDEANCE.661 - 860- 1106 RUDY OR LIISA
There exists no internal reliable investigative entity which can or will investigate criminal activity of civil servants. Extra legal status of any part of the Government will be the downfall of this nation. All government activity should have a shelf life as far as secrecy goes and upon expiration should be made public domain. Any website promoting the founding fathers interpretation of democracy , freedom of expression of speech, assembly,religion is not only a positive thing but one of the best concepts this country has tried to implement. If you doubt this I refer you to the captured archives of the gestapo for the city of wurtemburg germany 1932-1945 which americans overran at the end of WW2. One can see that "state security" can be subverted into petty acts of repression and abject terror, supported by internal corruption and rife with internal political rot. The supprising thing about Germany from 1919 to 1933 is the incremental way in which freedom and dignity were stripped from a people and the resulting in abuse terror and murder which followed. Can't happen here? well I can only direct you to a 1970's psychological test conducted at stanford university which had to be terminated due to the fact that some participants were in danger of being harmed. It must be noted that the Psycologists had not predicted this behavior or recognized the symptoms untill well into the test. So even highly educated people did not percieve the gradual subversion of judgement for a long time. Add in the fear of secret police and you have a recipe for disaster no matter the time or place.
I know who you are and I know what you did. I'm out here and I'm watching you.
We're dangerously close to being a police state. I have moral and religious objections to a great many decisions of the high courts, and especially of several members of the Supreme Court. I have objections to having to kao-tao to certain immoral behaviors since they are legal. Video surveilance of the population is goign to render the above moot... I wonder how long until I get arrested for crossing myself in public, since that implies I am anti-gay-marriage. (I am, but as yet, it's not hate speech to say so...)
one camera for every 14 people in the u.k. ? fact... do you really want to be followed everywhere? noone laughs and says its not an Orwellian 1984 nightmare anymore do they !!! fight back !!!
The fact is that all that camera intrusion into our lives in the u.k. has NOT reduced crime at all. it is an excuse also to monitor customer use of commercial districts under the guise of "security" without needing local planning permission... the paranoid state is a dangerous state... witness the invasion of Iraq... surely THAT is where the security technology should be headed towards but is it????? NO. Wonder why ?????
The Britain of today IS a police state, we are policed by camera and computer.. and this is to the detriment of people. We are losing MORE civil rights every day, and ID cards are on the program to be introduced.. I for one WILL NOT be asked to "show my papers" on the streets of a country my grandfathers died to protect.